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not1perfect |
Why All the Talk About "Crucifying the Flesh" |
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I came out of an Independent Pente. Church (from what I understand it was much like the Oneness but they believed in the Trinity). They were always preaching
about how we need to "crucify the flesh" or "put the flesh under". It's like they wanted you to feel "bad" for being
"human" - however, as long as we are on this earth we are human! Why all this talk about "crucifying the flesh or putting the flesh
under"?
Last Edited By: not1perfect 06/18/09 03:19:19.
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boustro |
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You said it: to make you feel bad for being human. No human pleasures are allowed. And no human suffering can be regretted -- we were to rejoice in
it.
Very sick.
Tim
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not1perfect |
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What I could never understand was why was going to a football game and "screaming" or "yelling" a no, no, and "wordly", but on
the other hand coming to church and screaming, yelling, running around the church, dancing, etc., ok? It's like they expected you to be "robot
like" except in church.
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tandc90 |
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Good point, Not. And for all the talk of crucifying the flesh they sure like to indulge their own fleshly desires to lose control emotionally, gossip,
criticize, condemn others, be mean to others, judge others, etc. I could go on and on.
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not1perfect |
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tandc90 - Right on!! They were among the most judgmental, uncompassionate, cruel and meanest people I have ever met. I guess they thought they were "super humans" (they did refer to themselves as "saints") which fed their arrogance and false sense of superiority.
Last Edited By: not1perfect
06/17/09 15:38:47.
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DiamondGirllovesHarleys |
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I was always told that crucifying the flesh meant to die to self. Which means anything that you want and even need has to be done away with. In other words if
you need money just pray for it and believe God to provide(the bible teaches a man don't work he don't eat)if you need food just pray for it after all
God feed Eljiah iwth with the ravens. In other words anything that "normal" people would do is considered fleshly. I have even heard of people saying
God told them to leave their jobs and depend entirely upon him. That is not what the bible teaches even Jesus had a job other than preaching. Anything that
made you look human was wrong anything that made you look all super spiritual was right. I used to repent for being human. I'm serious I used to cry out to
God all the time and say God I can't do this. I can't be like what they say I should be like. I tried so hard. However the more I learned the more I
began to realize that these people are not like God that God is not mean that He is not out to get me like they made me feel like,that I didn't have to be
perfect. That to stop being human would mean I had to die and it isn't my time yet. We live here on earth in a body made of flesh we live in real
situations that need real answers not this stuff that tells us we are wrong for being human and have to repent for being human. The bible says those whom the
son has set free is free indeed,it doesn't say that we are free to be in bondage to all these rules.
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so new |
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bill g used to say what ever your mind came up for a answer to a problem then gods way was just the opposite and you had to have a biblical reason not a reason
as determined by your functioning mind.
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not1perfect |
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These pentes condemned and condemned the congregation so much that when I left there I was so full of self-hate and self-loathing that I laid on the sofa for days deep in depression. Then I realized that this wasn't God making me feel this way - this condemnation was coming from these pente people - constantly hammering at us that we had to "die to self" "crucify the flesh" do this, do that ,etc. Then I remembered a song "Just As I Am........ "and then I felt like a "ton of bricks" had been lifted off from me.
Last Edited By: not1perfect
06/17/09 16:08:45.
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DiamondGirllovesHarleys |
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I love that song just as I am if its the same one I am thinking of. I also like the one In the Garden. I think sometimes these people need to stop and listen
to the words they sing. Like have they really took the time to listen to Amazing Grace. They sing that and sing it but I don't think they get its true
meaning.
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lozza |
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This is another sore topic for me. Songs like "Set my spirit free that I might worship you" come to mind.
I never got used to all the talk of "the flesh" and "fleshly desires", and I felt as though these over-the-top religious people were putting me in a straightjacket of sorts. "Don't be human, don't experience emotion unless it's for the sake of the gospel, don't enjoy yourself or you're sinning". "Take heed that ye not be deceived". (Yes, seriously!!! I listened to some awful tapes on this subject.) "If he's not Lord of all, he's not Lord at all," one woman from a "holiness group" snarled at me, brandishing her second finger to make a point. "You've got to be holy!" |
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not1perfect |
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Diamondgirl - I think the bottom line is they really don't believe in grace - in the church I was in they never sang songs about grace - like Amazing Grace
or Just As I am - they always sang really, really fast songs to get the emotions all pumped up and the adrenaline flowing. (like I'll fly Away, etc.).
They were downright "self-righteous" and "holier than thou". If they believed in grace it would have made them humble instead of puffed-up
with pride, arrogance and self-righteousness. (I believe it states in the bible: "that it's not by works lest any man should boast") and they
were the most boastful crowd I ever saw - the pastor was constantly "boasting" about how much "annointing he had" how many
"gifts" he had, how "holy he was", how "God was using him"., etc. It was sickening!!!!
Last Edited By: not1perfect
06/18/09 03:44:21.
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tandc90 |
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so new wrote: Ugh. I've heard that type of thinking. How did I ever lose so much mental ability to actually fall for it?? I used to hear Ken Hagin quoted a lot, something along the lines of the devil is a liar so whatever he puts in your mind is a lie. Translated that means anything in your mind is a lie and you're to do/think/feel/say the opposite. I guess that thought that popped into your mind to jump in and save a drowning person was the debble, eh? |
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not1perfect |
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The Pente. church I went to preached against Ken Hagin and said he was a "false teacher". However, the pastor in the church I went to preached
"that we must become as perfect as Jesus was and as holy as God" in order to go to heaven!! As far as I'm concerned any "pente" is
false!!!
Last Edited By: not1perfect
06/18/09 16:57:33.
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marla191792 |
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bill g used to say what ever your mind came up for a answer to a problem then gods way was just the opposite and you had to have a biblical reason not a reason as determined by your functioning mindThey teach you to doubt your own mind, to constantly question whether your thoughts are even your own or possibly implanted there by Satan. How can you reach rational conclusions with that mindset? It turns someone into a very passive person who just accepts whatever he/she is told from the pulpit. |
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lozza |
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Exactly, Marla.
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not1perfect |
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They try to get us to "trust" them and they want to "shatter" the belief in the one person we should "trust" ourselves!
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RogerDodger |
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Read your bible.Everything pointed to a first century ending of the world.Why do you think they preached not to marry if you weren't married at the
time.People thought that Christ was returning IN THEIR LIFETIME. The scriptures that modern day preachers use to browbeat their congregations were meant for
the people two thousand years ago,not us. I'm just sick as hell at all the Christians that pull their little verses out of the bible and smugly use them
for a point.I'm SICK of them.SICK SICK SICK of them.....There,I feel better saying that.
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not1perfect |
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RogerDodger wrote:Roger - feel the same as you. SICK, SICK, SICK. They use bible verses to try to "manipulate" people for their own gain or agenda. These so called Christians are Toxic!!!! |
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charliedog |
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marla191792 wrote:MARLA! GO MARLA! GO MARLA! GO MARLA! Marla hits it right on the head - exact, succinct, wise and brilliant as always. Frankly, the idea that Satan is invading your thoughts, usually comes from our brothers and sisters on planet Paranoid Schizophrenic. |
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DiamondGirllovesHarleys |
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There is alot of undiagnosed mental illness in these churchs. I have seen so many things of people who needed help and never got it
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charliedog |
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RogerDodger wrote: |
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