But how many times and how many of us have sat there..being threatened by "GOD"...and how many have thought about how bad things happen to good people all the time? And does "God" send these bad things?
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charliedog |
Better to keep quiet to others? |
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Was it WalkawayArchie who said this? That people not involved with ex-pente-charismania just would not believe the things that we've been through... I
read that and wondered if it is wiser to keep quiet about it to the outside world? What do others on the board think? Because it would just sound nutty to
those who haven't experienced it. The fact that I can actually admit that I'm scared God will "GET" me because of what I am writing... that
just sounds paranoid doesn't it.
But how many times and how many of us have sat there..being threatened by "GOD"...and how many have thought about how bad things happen to good people all the time? And does "God" send these bad things? |
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bootsiebabe |
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Thankfully there are people out there who have not experienced what some of us lived through. It's a good feeling and it gives me hope in mankind.
All that comes to mind.... "the least of these"...
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walkawayarchie |
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It's healing to talk about it- not only cathartic for the person, but also VERY helpful and VERY healing to others to realize that they're not alone in
what they experienced.
Also, this is what the Pentecostals/Dominionists/Fundamentalists want us to do- not let others know how wrong and even EVIL they are. They flourish as long as they aren't exposed. Charliedog, I sometimes feel like God is beating me up, but that is the hateful, unforgiving, legalistic "God" who doesn't forgive or forget the slightest mistake and who doesn't cut any slack for human weaknesses - the one preached by those types. Something I've also observed- they teach responsibility for what happens to one, but NOT responsibility for the harm one does to others (except when your decision means they don't get as much of your money as they think they should get!) Think about it- I'd bet that like me, you'd realize that most of the bad things you've been through can be traced to someone's greed, or selfishness, or outright EVIL- and NOT ANYTHING YOU DID (except maybe to make a minor mistake like trusting a preacher). And then you probably got "punished" by the church if you opened your mouth about the bad things and the connection to decisions/actions made by someone else. I know when bad happened and I "complained", I was punished in the Dominionist churches I attended - punished by people with nice comfortable lives (who had all their needs met) who only suffered in their life when they were caught doing wrong!!! Believe me, I know where you are coming from. I felt like I was being "beat up" two weeks ago - when all in one day I found out that someone had screwed up my research funding, that it had been cut back by nearly 20%, that it would take several days to fix (almost two weeks), our dog died (how evil or guilty can an old and sweet dog be?), and my job for the fall had been canceled because of funding cuts, and on top of that I "heard" while praying "SHUT UP AND STOP CRYING!!! YOU WANT A PITY PARTY? YOU WANT A PITY PARTY?? YOU WANT A PITY PARTY???" I might add that we had to borrow money in order to survive these last couple of weeks. That's not fun. (We live a very simple life- our only "extravagant" expense is cable- but we both have to have cable internet anyway for our jobs/research! We're "not rich" and know how to be careful!) I refuse to believe that what I "heard" was God talking, and if it was "God", I'd turn my back on that "God" irregardless of what that "God" promised me or did to me. I won't have anything more to do with abusive treatment- I've had many lifetime's worth already. (I recognized later that what I 'heard' was echos from the Assemblies I attended many years ago- that was the sort of %#+% they'd say to me!) There are other "echos" from the Assemblies that I deal with on nearly a daily basis that I haven't related. |
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tandc90 |
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I think it depends on the situation whether to keep quiet or not, but mostly I think it really depends on your personality. For instance, if I were to mention
some about my charismatic past to a charismatic they'd feel compelled to defend it. Personally I just don't want to go there most of the time.
But that's just me. I'm not a debating type of person. I'm glad others are because it was non-charismatics willing to debate charismatics on a message board that played a huge role in leading me out. Ultimately if one doesn't feel comfortable revealing any religious history or even trying to correct a charismatic there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Being free to be yourself is part of clearing your mind of the charismaniac brainwashing. I did enough obligatory things while a charismatic. No need to do them these days. |
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walkawayarchie |
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It's not worth wasting your breath or time talking with Charismatics/Pentecostals/Dominionists. I avoid places where they hang out like the plague. (THANK!
GOD! FOR MODERATORS WHO ARE ON THE BALL!!!)
They have to learn for themselves what the TRUTH is, before they will listen to someone else. That is a painful process. It's one I went through. |
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Lutherius |
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It is a good idea not to talk about our crazy experiences to normal people. You are right. They probably will not understand, and might think you scary.
Lutherius
"I cannot and I will not recant. Here I stand; I can do no other." Martin Luther Ex-Pentecostal Forums Lutherius' Blog (Archived Essays) Pentecostal Watchdog Society (Yahoo Allied Group) derkrash@earthlink.net (My Personal Email) |
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Taco Fred |
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I have always kept the penteville experiences silent. No one would ever believe anything so outrageous. I would not have believed any of the stuff if I had not
went through it and seen it with my own eyes.
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Lutherius |
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Yeah, it needs to be emphasized that in our recovery from Pentecostalism, the concept "Honesty is the best policy" is a very good rule of thumb.
However, telling people about our experiences if they have no clue of the evil humans are capable of can be damaging to our social connections.
Just be very careful who you share these things with. We have been through Hell, and many people have no idea of the horror down there.
Lutherius
"I cannot and I will not recant. Here I stand; I can do no other." Martin Luther Ex-Pentecostal Forums Lutherius' Blog (Archived Essays) Pentecostal Watchdog Society (Yahoo Allied Group) derkrash@earthlink.net (My Personal Email) |
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walkawayarchie |
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Lutherius, you said it.
I guess I should have qualified what I said in that I "talk" only around people who've been there (like on blogs like this one)- and watch what I say near others. In a context like this, I feel talking is important. Indeed, for many years after I walked, I thought what I'd gone through was normal- even though it didn't "compute" or make sense and was very painful (and I knew the things I saw in the Assemblies not only bothered me, but I KNEW they were wrong). It wasn't until I got met a friend who introduced me to the people fighting against Dominionism and one of them, (my friend dogemperor) who introduced me to a couple of walkaway communities, that I realized just how wrong it all was- and worse, how common it was. I'm still learning- over 26 years later. |
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CaroG87 |
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I don't talk much about it except with other XPC'ers -- and my best friend and her husband. They were the ones who took the initiative to invite me to
Mass. And it helps that her grandmother is the same denomination I was raised in, so she understands at least the lingo (not the mindset, but...). There are
maybe a couple of others to whom I've mentioned things, but I had to do some explaining over the years to help them see it through my eyes.
That's why I'm kind of reticent to discuss Sunday's Pentecost homily with our deacon..... it was a good sermon, but again, I'm guessing that he doesn't get that some of the phrases which he used in the sermon ring an entirely different bell in my head, the one that is accompanied by sirens and "Danger, Will Robinson!" |
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treelee |
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This is such a good question. I usually keep quiet. My imediate family are all to aware of what I went through (they begged me not to join) and my boyfriend
knows some of what I went though. My reactions in certain situations are so strange that I have to explain myself and my b/f gets it now and knows how/why I
react to certain things or situations. This board has been WONDERFUL becasue I can speak freely without anyone thinking I am a total crazy person. More than
anything I would love to put an end to this religion. I would love to have the courage to stand up in a convention hall and speak freely to people about how
distructive the pente denomination is. I dream of finding the courage to turn in their "schools" and have them shut down. I will never have the
courage because deep down, I still think that God would punish me for doing either of those things.
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lozza |
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I sometimes talk to people about what went on in charismania, but I'm basically wary about sharing my experiences with others, as a lot of the stuff does
sound crazy. I certainly never blog about religion.
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charliedog |
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treelee wrote:WalkawayArchie, I just want to say that I really hope things get good for you soon and I totally sympathise with the horror of losing a old sweet natured dog. (hugs to you) Treelee! "This board has been WONDERFUL because i can speak freely without anyone thinking I am a total crazy person." I couldn't agree with you more. A man that I love very deeply, has just got in contact again, telling me to free myself from charismania. (we've not really been in touch since I tried to exorcise him. YES I KNOW WHAT THE HEL WAS I THINKING.. ???? ) and he thinks I'm still in that weird place. Thanks to this board, I've met brilliant vibrant intelligent thinking people who have also made mistakes, and so I feel OK. I feel that when I get the courage to face this very special man again, I can find the words...firstly of apology...secondly, of how ... (oh..what? I've lost the words..hmm) |
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tandc90 |
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Charliedog, is this the man you've been brokenhearted about? I hope so and I hope it works out for y'all!
<--used to have a dog named Charlie too. |
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treelee |
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Charliedog - I hope you find the words. It is hard to explain and impossible to justify how we have acted in the past. I just tell people it was during my
crazy years and I can't be held responsible
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walkawayarchie |
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Three simple words can make all the difference- "I was wrong".
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treelee |
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Very true. It is often hard to admit when you are wrong and that goes along way.
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charliedog |
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Tanc90, Treelee and Walkaway, Hugs from Charliedog.
Thank you for your wise words, kindness and advice. Yes, this is the man I've been broken hearted about. Yes, indeed, an apology with "I was wrong" is exactly right. He texted me to say that my belief was based on magic, nonsense and religion and I should free my heart. Isn't that just what we've all been saying to each other? If I had not found this forum and the people on, I don't know where I would be. He called, very very drunk from London and we had a great conversation - as much as one can when one person is drunk and the other is totally embarrassed about exorcism. (there is a sentence I never thought I'd write). We are not a couple again, but at least we've talked, and so I can stop crying into my pillow at night. He has such integrity and is so forgiving....and is so much nicer than any man I've ever met in a church. So thanks and I do appreciate your concern. Walkaway, I have been thinking about those horrific mocking words, "you want a pity party?" and how disturbing it must be to have them in your mind and I wondered about them as I walked the dog today. I wondered if those words were in your subconcious as a sort of a representation of the cruelty within Pentecostalism? Because that phrase, is a mockery of empathy and kindness. Yet, as humans, our need for empathy and kindness is very real and part of all our lives. I'd like to say that it comes from God, but does it? I don't know. Anyway, Walkaway, I do hope you never have those words back again. They are chilling and dreadful. |
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WildCard39 |
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Taco Fred wrote: I rather they think I'm stable....
~Unfortunately, humans are a plague-like species, governed by greed and delusions of mythology and self-deluding grandeur.~ SA ~ Well behaved women rarely made history ~ Eleanor Roosevelt "~Faith: not wanting to know what is true." ~ (Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche) Paul Allen: Is that a rain coat? Patrick Bateman: Yes it is!! |
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charliedog |
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Good point wildcard. I can remember pre-charismania days of stability.
I looked up info about the big deal church I used to attend. Holy Trinity - home of the Alpha course. The Cult infomation centre (government run) has got its eye on it, and it has all the elements of pentecostalism. |
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marla191792 |
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charlie, I'm so sorry. And be comforted at least that I think all of us (or most of us, anyway) are horribly embarrassed about stupid things we did when
we were Pentes and now we wonder what we were thinking. The guilt of participating in some things can be awful, but remember that at the time, I'm sure
you really believed it was the right thing to do. When we are deceived and brainwashed, we do things we wouldn't normally do. It's sort of like if
you agreed to have the doctor amputate your arm after he told you that it was the only was to save your life, and then later, you found out that the
'doctor' got his degree from a crackerjack box and there was nothing wrong with your arm--a foolish decision to let the quack take your arm off, but
one made at the moment trusting someone who you thought knew better than you. These Pentecostal leaders set themselves up in a position of authority and teach
everyone not to question. We believed them, and so we did stuff that we thought was right, only to realize later that the joke was on us. Don't beat
yourself up too much.
I hope things work out for you, and that at least you can find peace in this. The ones that haunt me the most are the ones that I don't know where they are anymore and so I can't apologize. I'm glad you had a good conversation with your friend. I have found that those that I have apologized to are surprisingly forgiving. Some even started sending me Christmas cards. lol. I agree with Luth that it is usually better not to share with just anyone these stories, but for those who are close, it is sometimes helpful. I have found that it helps people understand better sometimes if you let them watch a video, because they find it very hard to picture otherwise. The movie 'Marjoe' is fantastic in this regard, and I have given it to several good friends to illustrate what I am talking about. For very close friends who know about my PTSD, I have sometimes let them watch the Hallelujah Prayer Center videos. I guess I do that because I am afraid they won't believe me. (For those who are relatively new to the board, when I was a teenager, I used to go to a place called Hallelujah Prayer Center where a woman 'healer' would do healings by cutting people and pulling bits of tissue out of their bodies that she claimed were 'cancers'. This was done without anesthesia and the effect was ... well, mostly, what you would expect when people were being cut with no anesthesia. Screams, blood, crying ...) I can only say to those who ever do want to share their story (or even if you don't, because you might change your mind) ... if you've got photos or video, keep it. There's always a tendency for people to think, "Oh, surely it wasn't really like that ..." But there's no arguing with videotape. |
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